124 Is Investing In Programs To Learn The Business Worth It And Necessary?

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124 Is Investing In Programs To Learn The Business Worth It And Necessary?

Today’s Ugly Question:

” Is investing in programs to learn the business worth it and necessary? “

Carolina Capital is a hard money lender serving the needs of the “Real Estate Investor” and the “Small Builder” borrower who is striving to build wealth and generate income for themselves and their families. We offer “hard money rehab loans” and “Ground-up Construction Loans” for investors only in NC, SC, GA, VA, and TN (some areas of FL, as well).

As part of our business practices, we also serve as consultants for investors guiding them to network with other investors and educating them in locating and structuring transactions. Rarely, if ever, will you find a hard money lender willing to invest in your success like Carolina Capital Management.

Bill Fairman (00:00):

All investigations.

Bill Fairman (00:02):

Hi everyone. We’re just sitting here talking amongst ourselves. Have you ever wondered if buying programs or investing in programs that teach you the business, you know, are they worth it? Well, right after this, we’ll let you know. And obviously it’s just our opinion,

Wendy Sweet (00:29):

Which is way important.

Jonathan Davis (00:30):

To us, anyway.

Bill Fairman (00:30):

Thank you for joining us on the Ask an Ugly Question segment of the Active Income, Passive Wealth show. I’m Bill Fairman. This is Wendy sweet and Jonathan Davis. We are Carolina Capital Management. We make loans in the Southeast to real estate investors. If you are a borrower and you’re interested in borrowing money, go to CarolinaHardMoney.com and click on the apply now tab. If you’re an investor looking for passive returns, then click on the accredited investor tab. Don’t forget to share like subscribe, hit the bell, all that good stuff.

Jonathan Davis (01:09):

That’s right.

Bill Fairman (01:10):

I’m not going to say anything about last week’s show on why I’m speaking properly now.

Jonathan Davis (01:16):

Take care of your words.

Wendy Sweet (01:19):

We were commenting on how green I look and I’m wearing the color of what money used to be, right?

Bill Fairman (01:27):

What’s the color of a pixel now, whatever you want it today,

Bill Fairman (01:32):

It depends. The attorney answer.

Wendy Sweet (01:36):

That’s right.

Bill Fairman (01:36):

So, there’s been some interesting news in the economic front. You know what, before we do that, let’s do the breaking news.

Wendy Sweet (01:50):

That sounds good.

Bill Fairman (02:03):

Okay. Just so everyone in the audience knows. We know you can hear us when these things are going up, the graphics are going off in the back.

Wendy Sweet (02:15):

We just don’t care.

Bill Fairman (02:15):

Well, yeah. It just didn’t bother us.

Jonathan Davis (02:15):

I didn’t know. I thought I was muted.

Wendy Sweet (02:15):

There weren’t dirty words. The breaking news is,

Bill Fairman (02:16):

Stop it. The employment number, leave me alone. The employment numbers are higher than they expected them again. So that’s something to keep an eye on. They’ve adjusted last weeks employment and unemployment numbers up from what they showed last time too. So, I’m not going to give you the actual details, but they’re higher. That’s not a good thing.

Wendy Sweet (02:50):

Are they judging that on people who are applying for unemployment?

Bill Fairman (02:53):

Yes.

Wendy Sweet (02:53):

Or people that’s just claiming, I don’t have a job.

Bill Fairman (02:53):

New employment, new unemployment claim, and then continuing claims. And then they use the unemployment rate, the rate of, you know, the percentage of people that are unemployed, which kind of kills me if you’re giving up and you’ve stopped looking. You’re no longer on that list of unemployed.

Wendy Sweet (03:17):

Yeah. So what happens to that?

Bill Fairman (03:18):

So you get disappeared.

Wendy Sweet (03:20):

Well, then it skews the numbers of reality, right?

Bill Fairman (03:25):

Yes, it always has.

Wendy Sweet (03:25):

So it’s actually probably worse than what we’re seeing

Bill Fairman (03:27):

That’s called the labor participation rate. And they don’t show that overtime

Jonathan Davis (03:32):

You don’t participate. You don’t get counted.

Bill Fairman (03:34):

Correct.

Jonathan Davis (03:34):

Which is, you know, may or may not be like elections.

Wendy Sweet (03:37):

That’s right,

Bill Fairman (03:38):

Which is a little bit more crucial to us is the housing numbers. And I hate reading off paper, but there’s a lot of them here. So I’m going to start here.

Wendy Sweet (03:47):

And he’ll never remember.

Bill Fairman (03:47):

Housing starts, for January, decreased 6% from the previous month of December

Wendy Sweet (03:55):

Is that world? I mean, nationwide?

Bill Fairman (03:55):

Nationally.

Wendy Sweet (03:55):

Okay.

Bill Fairman (03:55):

All these numbers are going to be national. Home building fell at 2.3% on a year, over year basis. So,

Wendy Sweet (04:09):

That’s interesting.

Bill Fairman (04:10):

0.3% less than last year in January.

Wendy Sweet (04:14):

That’s very interesting.

Bill Fairman (04:17):

And here’s part of the reason, softwood lumber prices jumped 73%.

Wendy Sweet (04:23):

Yeah. That is insane,

Jonathan Davis (04:26):

What were we talking about yesterday? That,

Bill Fairman (04:28):

Steel prices,

Jonathan Davis (04:29):

It’s the same price now to do a steel frame house as it is a wood-frame.

Wendy Sweet (04:35):

Crazy, absolutely crazy.

Bill Fairman (04:36):

You’re looking for cheaper alternatives, which in this case there isn’t a cheaper alternative.

Jonathan Davis (04:43):

There’s just one that’s equivalent.

Bill Fairman (04:45):

Now you can utilize steel and it’s probably a better product to build a house out of anyway, except for [inaudible]

Wendy Sweet (04:57):

Why did wood go up in the first place? Wasn’t it because those companies were shut down for a while?

Bill Fairman (05:02):

Not necessarily, it’s a combination of things. Part of it was that.

Jonathan Davis (05:06):

And then, so then the other part is logistics getting it to places,

Wendy Sweet (05:10):

Huh? Well, the trucking industry’s doing still really well. Right?

Bill Fairman (05:14):

Remember, we had five hurricanes and Louisiana this summer.

Wendy Sweet (05:19):

Is that where the Wood’s coming from? Or is that where it’s cut?

Bill Fairman (05:23):

That’s where the demand for lumber, there’s a lot more demand and it’s a little bit harder to get. And for some reason we only buy our wood from Canada instead of, apparently the U S doesn’t have enough lumber for us.

Wendy Sweet (05:41):

We don’t have any wood,

Bill Fairman (05:43):

The lumber that we’re getting, we’re shipping overseas and the lumber we need, we have to bring in from Canada.

Wendy Sweet (05:48):

Somebody worked that one out for me. Well, the reason I was asking is because you know, how prices on things tend to go up there, go up fast, but they’re slow to come back down and I wonder if they’re not pushing it a little.

Bill Fairman (06:01):

I mean, it’s a commodity like anything else. And there’s a high demand for lumber right now. Again, a lot of it has having to do with repairing, a lot of it damaged from the hurricane. So you look at the problem with the recent cold in the deep South and you know, in Texas specifically. While they’re shut down and they’re in an emergency situation, it’s not like a hurricane. As soon as the temperature goes back up and then they fix the broken pipes, then they’re going to be fine. They’re going to be back to normal really quickly. A hurricane comes through and it takes a while before things get back to normal. Permits for a future home building shot up 10.4%.

Jonathan Davis (06:46):

That’s so interesting.

Bill Fairman (06:46):

They still want to bill. They just kinda said, wait a minute, let’s put the brakes on here. This stuff costs too much money. Let’s see if we can find an alternative or maybe land prices are going up.

Wendy Sweet (06:59):

Well, I’ll tell you what were happening locally is the permitting is taking so much longer what you put in for a permit because everybody’s working from home. It’s just taking a lot longer to get permits done. I mean, it’s significantly longer

Bill Fairman (07:14):

Yeah. Well, I mean, it depends on the municipalities you’re deal dealing with obviously,

Wendy Sweet (07:20):

Well, I’ve seen it in Rock Hill and Charlotte.

Bill Fairman (07:23):

No. What I’m saying is the ones that are a little bit better online and have a handle on it. The ones that don’t, don’t.

Wendy Sweet (07:32):

Both of those are online.

Bill Fairman (07:32):

Okay. Do they have to come out and see anything?

Wendy Sweet (07:38):

Yes, they do.

Bill Fairman (07:39):

Well, then you have to have employees from those municipalities physically go out and what’s happened during the pandemic with all the businesses shutting down,

Wendy Sweet (07:48):

Everybody’s working home.

Bill Fairman (07:48):

They have less money to work with. So are the municipality is going to hire more people to keep up with demand or are they just going to keep it a hiring freeze? Because they’re not getting the tax revenue.

Wendy Sweet (08:00):

That’s a good point. There’s more demands. So they don’t have the people to send out there.

New Speaker (08:04):

Right. So the business of building homes has picked up, but they’re not covering the shortfall in personnel because they’re not getting the income that they need to keep it up.

Jonathan Davis (08:16):

That’s a good point, Bill

Wendy Sweet (08:17):

So it starts her down by 6%.

Bill Fairman (08:22):

They’ve gotten the permit. They just haven’t started the pricing.

Jonathan Davis (08:25):

Because [Inaudible] be 73%.

Wendy Sweet (08:28):

It is crazy. That is absolutely crazy. Sheet rocks way up too.

Bill Fairman (08:33):

Yep. Everything has gone up because they keep printing dollars.

Wendy Sweet (08:39):

That’s much easier to do

Bill Fairman (08:40):

Now, single family housing or single family home building. And this is obviously the largest share of the housing market tumbled, 12.2%, and this is a seasonally adjusted. So this is 12.2% in January going. Yeah. That’s what I said.

Wendy Sweet (09:00):

Okay. I just wanted to make sure, cause I’ve heard that single family part

Bill Fairman (09:05):

1.6 million units this January versus last January so it’s gone down quite a bit. Single family starts increased for the eight straight months and permits rose 3.8% up until January. So, this is the first time they’ve actually gone down. It’s kinda interesting. Here’s what’s interesting. We know that people are demanding single family homes.

Jonathan Davis (09:35):

Yes. Affordable single family home.

Wendy Sweet (09:36):

Much more

Bill Fairman (09:38):

Starts for multifamily segment surged 17.1%.

Bill Fairman (09:43):

See? That’s just crazy.

Jonathan Davis (09:44):

Cause you have people out there telling that it’s the golden age of multi-family right now.

Bill Fairman (09:53):

So the starts, and we’re talking about 418,000 units.

Jonathan Davis (09:58):

Yeah. Well, and you’re talking about starts like new build multifamily, not like going in there and repositioning inside some existing, like we’re going to, it’s going to on average, they take two years to three years to bulid?

Wendy Sweet (10:11):

Yeah. And then they have building permits for multifamily soared 27.2%. And there, so that’s a 612,000 units that they got permits for now that they haven’t even started yet.

New Speaker (10:28):

Crazy.

New Speaker (10:29):

Now obviously real estate is local. And depending on listen, we have apartments going up everywhere around our areas because we have populations that are migrating here.

Jonathan Davis (10:43):

Sure.

Wendy Sweet (10:44):

And keep it kind coming, folks. We’re happy.

Bill Fairman (10:46):

And again, these are national numbers. I guarantee you in certain local markets. You’re not getting a lot of starts and a lot of permits.

Jonathan Davis (10:55):

You think there’s a lot of starts in New York?

Wendy Sweet (10:55):

Or you’re getting more than what we see.

New Speaker (10:59):

You’re going to have a lot of, what do they call it? Vacancy rates and those other larger areas that people are leaving.

Jonathan Davis (11:09):

Let’s talk about that. You’re getting migration from other places. And you know, were seeing into Texas into the Southeast, we’re seeing a lot of that migration and then we’re seeing these building starts now people who are migrating, they can’t find inventory to buy. So most of them have to rent. So maybe they’re going into an apartment, renting a house, whatever it may be, is that demand for that product still going to be there, which we don’t know. We’re just like that. Is it still going to be there two or three years from now?

Wendy Sweet (11:38):

Exactly.

Jonathan Davis (11:39):

Like when these new builds are done

Bill Fairman (11:42):

And how are they designing these newer multifamily? Are they going to be a little more open space? A+re they going to add more amenities they normally would have? If you look at, I know this is

Jonathan Davis (11:59):

Cause you like the co- COVID coefficient that have been put into things.

Bill Fairman (12:04):

If you look at universities and how they’re designing their housing and how they’re trying to get students in, and now this was prior to COVID, but they were offering, all kind of amenities for the housing at these universities to get people to go to their school. Indoor swimming pools and game rooms and spas and gyms inside of their freaking dorms.

Jonathan Davis (12:34):

Well, can I take a side on that one. That just shows you what is wrong with our education system.

Wendy Sweet (12:41):

That’s the truth

Jonathan Davis (12:41):

Where these universities are setting on billions of dollars of endowment that they invest. And the government is insuring people’s loans to go to school. And then there’s, you know, they’re going to school and picking the school by those indoor swimming pool, taking some course at the university. Talent is a great course, but there’s no jobs out there for it. It just, it drives me nuts.

Wendy Sweet (13:06):

it doesn’t make sense at all.

Jonathan Davis (13:07):

Universities are great. You know, if you want to have like a skilled profession that requires that. But you know, to do what Wendy, Bill and I do, you don’t need a degree.

Wendy Sweet (13:17):

That’s right. You don’t need no education at all.

Jonathan Davis (13:19):

Not that you shouldn’t get one that’s right. But you know, you don’t need one.

Wendy Sweet (13:23):

That’s right. You don’t need a degree to do what you don’t need a license. Well, you do need a license, but you don’t need a degree to get what we’re doing.

Jonathan Davis (13:31):

I interrupted you. Cause that’s just burns me out.

Wendy Sweet (13:32):

You’re absolutely right.

Bill Fairman (13:34):

No, you’re right. Larry Go used to say this all the time. I have a PhD. I have a public high school dorm and he’s done okay.

Bill Fairman (13:48):

Yeah. He’s done all right for himself. And it’s amazing. It is amazing that, you know, all of our younger generation is programmed to be able to go to university. That’s exactly what they’re, just their whole life like my kids.

Jonathan Davis (14:06):

There’s only one party that benefits from that.

Wendy Sweet (14:10):

That’s right.

Jonathan Davis (14:11):

The university.

Wendy Sweet (14:11):

That’s right.

Jonathan Davis (14:14):

They’re not liable for any, like, you don’t get a job they’re not allowed before you took some course that doesn’t do anything for you. You’re not allowed before, but you still have to pay, I was told to go to school. So I got a, you know, a dual bachelor degree and something that I don’t even use now. And I have pay the student loans. So I got this great degree. And in return, I got to pay $800 a month for student loans.

Wendy Sweet (14:37):

That’s right. How many times did I change my.

Bill Fairman (14:40):

Go ahead.

Wendy Sweet (14:40):

No. Never mind, go ahead

Bill Fairman (14:42):

I was gonna say, this is the last we’re going to talk about this cause we have to,

Jonathan Davis (14:46):

oh yeah. Sorry.

New Speaker (14:46):

The for-profit universities are under all this scrutiny from lawmakers because, you know, they say you’re paying a for-profit university and you’re not getting the job you promised. Well, do you think the major universities are not for profit, even though they’re called non-profit. Somebody who’s profiting. Right? Okay. So enough bloviating about this stuff.

Wendy Sweet (15:16):

Big word, big word.

New Speaker (15:16):

Let’s go to our ugly question. Okay. The ugly question today is, is investing in programs to learn about the business worth the money and you think it’s necessary?

Jonathan Davis (15:49):

Maybe more so than universities.

Wendy Sweet (15:52):

You know what, most, definitely more so than universities.

Jonathan Davis (15:56):

If we’re talking about real estate, which we are. Investing in programs to learn real estate or real estate related programs or ideas. Absolutely.

Wendy Sweet (16:05):

That’s for sure. I can tell you that any of the masterminds that we’re members of, they always give you the opportunity for your kids to sit in on it. Your teenage and early 20 kids to sit in on it. It is the best education they’ll ever get. It’s real world investing and you can’t, well, you can pay enough, but normally I would say you can’t pay enough for an education like that and it just takes you right to the heart of things. But I, you know, when we were talking about this question earlier, we were talking about really, it depends on where you are in the investing world. You know, how brand spanking new are you and you know, what your niche is. You know, are you going to wholesale? Are you going to fix and flip? You know, you have to kind of figure out where you want to be. And before you can even learn all that, you really need to understand what’s even out there. And you find that out by joining these, you know, your local real estate investor association, getting on biggerpockets.com and seeing what other people are doing, that kind of education is really, really inexpensive. And as you get more and more experienced in the real world, then you can figure out what you want to spend money on in learning a program or paying money on a big program, because I’ve seen people spend over a hundred thousand dollars, easy on education stuff. And then when they try to, you know, start getting into the field and getting loans, they don’t qualify because they’re so into debt from what they paid on the education. That’s just crazy.

Jonathan Davis (17:46):

Bill, will you scroll down? It says we have new comments. I just,

Wendy Sweet (17:48):

What’s your thought, Jonathan?

Jonathan Davis (17:48):

I just want to see if there’s a new comment before I move on. Okay. Bill’s not doing the scrolling job.

Bill Fairman (18:00):

It should do it automatically. We should be more automated.

Jonathan Davis (18:03):

You know, my thoughts on the education piece, or you can pick up, if you are new, I would not recommend going into these high level or high costs education. You need to start small and see if it’s something even for you. You know, start with your local RIAs, those are minimal costs. Then you can start with a small masterminds or small, educational groups or educational, or I guess educators.

Wendy Sweet (18:32):

Who sell their meat.

Jonathan Davis (18:34):

Who sell their stuff. But one of the biggest values that you can get from doing these education, I don’t know what they’re like.

Wendy Sweet (18:46):

seminars.

Jonathan Davis (18:46):

Seminars or whatever webinars, probably more webinars now, is the network that you can build. Some of these things, you know, we’ve done and we paid a thousand, 5,000 whatever, but the connections that you can get from that can get your next deal done, or it can get you, a connection to selling a loan or.

Wendy Sweet (19:08):

Or a lender

Jonathan Davis (19:10):

So, even if the education doesn’t quite give you what you’re looking for, sometimes the networking that you pick up from, it gives you far more than the initial investment.

Wendy Sweet (19:23):

Absolutely, absolutely. And I can say that every event I go to is number one, networking’s the number one reason why we’re there is to pick up, and it’s not just, you know, we’re not just looking for borrowers and I’m, we’re not just looking for lenders. We’re looking for people that we can network with across the country.

Bill Fairman (19:45):

Like-minded individuals.

Wendy Sweet (19:45):

That can, you know, help help us through problems. Cause we’re gonna step in the same pile. So pick that everybody else.

Jonathan Davis (19:51):

I mean, some of the people that we network with the most and we were contact with most, we don’t even do deals or anything with them. We just, you know, they’ve had a problem. We’ve helped them think through it and we’ve had a problem and they’ve helped us think through it. But we wouldn’t have known them if we hadn’t gone to those things.

Wendy Sweet (20:06):

That’s exactly right.

Bill Fairman (20:08):

All right. So my 2 cents worth,

Bill Fairman (20:10):

And that’s how you get is two minutes and two cents

Bill Fairman (20:12):

When I tell people that they need to join their local REIA group or their local meetup group, they’re typically going to have national speakers involved in those throughout the year. The membership for those groups is fairly attractive. Inexpensive. I don’t want to say cheap because it is the least expensive education you can get. It gives you a good broad range of what’s available out there. Keep your wallet in your pocket or at home when you hear these great programs, because if you’re like me and you have shiny object syndrome and this is the greatest program since sliced bread, and you’re going to want to buy it well, just hang on to it because it still, I’m not saying programs aren’t worth it. I think there are plenty of programs out there that are very worth it. The thing you want to figure out is what’s going to be a good fit for you and your current situation as it sits now and you can never go wrong with learning the real estate fundamentals. Those courses are always going to be in style in Vogue. Doesn’t matter, markets are going to change but you still have to have real estate fundamentals down. And I think knowing the note business is one of the biggest fundamentals, but you still need to know how to negotiate. You still need to know which property types are going to be the most liquid, all that type of thing and you’re going to get a lot of that through your REIA groups. And then there are plenty of educators that still teach the fundamentals.

Wendy Sweet (21:56):

I’m not just looking through here, I’m getting ready to get some free stuffs out.

Bill Fairman (21:58):

And by the way, our next guest Ron LeGrand, is one of those people that teaches stuff that is old school.

Wendy Sweet (22:08):

We are on Facebook right now. Hey!

Bill Fairman (22:08):

Yes ma’am.

Jonathan Davis (22:11):

That’s funny.

Bill Fairman (22:11):

He teaches these fundamentals that are never going to go out of style. By the way, before we get too late in the show, we’re going to have to get out of here quickly. Don’t forget that the cashflow expo has started today and you can still register. If you haven’t already through that link, that’s scrolling across the screen. We’ll put that up in the chat box as well. If you miss some of it today, you should, buy the ticket that allows you the recordings, because this is another opportunity to find out all the different aspects of real estate investing. This is a three-day event. You’re going to have people in all different sides of the real estate space speaking, and it gives you a good idea of what’s out there and what may be a good fit for you, right?

Wendy Sweet (23:01):

Yeah, that’s exactly right. And I’m going to give out some free things that you guys need to sign up for free education, just get on these sites. The first one is, www.IRARocketFuel.com. That’s the financial friends network. It’s like getting on a Facebook. Yeah, it’s a Facebook page, but there’s free recorded seminars on there that you can, It’s a great group to network with free good stuff. Awesome national speakers. You also want to get hooked up with Jim Angesaul’s real estate investor.

Bill Fairman (23:44):

Jim does a weekly live stream as well.

Wendy Sweet (23:48):

Well, not just weekly. He’s posting stuff every single day, that gets you hooked up with other people who are really, really, really good at what they do.

Bill Fairman (24:01):

that’s probably why he didn’t have un on REIA

Wendy Sweet (24:01):

It’s called The Real Estate Investor Network. The Real Estate Investor Network. So Google that get on his facebook.

Jonathan Davis (24:08):

And then also Sonrisers, your subgroup.

Wendy Sweet (24:11):

Oh yea. It’s free.

Jonathan Davis (24:12):

It’s free. You can, it’s on, you said it’s on Facebook?

Wendy Sweet (24:15):

Well, you can go to, yeah, you can get all the Sonrisers there’s page on Facebook. It’s S O N risers. Cause it is a faith-based group. We meet every Friday morning at 7:30 AM. It’s on zoom and we’re on there for an hour. It’s incredible. So, yeah, there’s a lot of good free education out there and understand that if you get signed up with that cashflow expo, that’s already started. If you, when you pay, you’re going to get the recording. So you’ll be able to watch what you’ve missed already anyway.

Jonathan Davis (24:51):

And one of the things, you know, getting in your REIAs, like networking with real live people, I guess, you know,

Wendy Sweet (24:58):

Rather than dead people.

Jonathan Davis (25:00):

Rather than the virtual, and I guess it can be virtual, that more things are now but develop that sounding board, those people who are your sounding board, because I mean, there’s been so many times, I think, you know, I suffer, you know, Bill suffers some shiny object I suffer from, I have the greatest idea, you know, it’s, you know,

Wendy Sweet (25:17):

And it’s not.

Jonathan Davis (25:18):

And then you talk to people about the people that you trust and you’re like, and they’re like, no, don’t do that. And here’s why it’s like, Oh, I didn’t even think about that. You need those people when you’re getting into this and even all the way through to help you realize, well, yeah, that program, I did it two years ago, but you know, it wasn’t quite what I expected. I didn’t get much from it or that program, yes. You need to do that program because it will take you to the next level. So it’s just networking and get people who are sounding boards

Bill Fairman (25:51):

Okay.

Wendy Sweet (25:52):

We’re good.

Bill Fairman (25:52):

We’re ready to go.

Wendy Sweet (25:55):

Wrap her up.

Bill Fairman (25:55):

Thank you so much for joining us here on the Active Income, Passive Wealth show. Thank you Cherub for putting that up there because I was starting to stumble on it. We are Carolina Capital Management. We make loans in the Southeast and if you’re a borrower thinking about getting a loan, CarolinaHardMoney.com click on the apply now tab. If you’re a passive investor, interested in passive returns, click on the accredited investor tab. Don’t forget to share, like, subscribe, hit the bell, all that good stuff. And there’s link to our next show with Ron LeGrand is coming up here momentarily. It was great seeing you

Bill Fairman (26:36):

One last thing. If you’re looking for a property, I know of one for a fix and flip in Mooresville, North Carolina. So feel like if you liked that area, let me know

Wendy Sweet (26:44):

Awesome.

Bill Fairman (26:45):

That would be jonathan@carolinahardmoney.com. Take care.

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